Is Technology Changing Our Minds?By Ryan Howes
Right now, we’re all subjects of what’s arguably the most widespread, fastest-paced, unplanned experiment on human psychology ever conducted in history. The research question is: what happens to the human brain when, within a few short decades, it’s introduced—in fact, saturated in—a radically new, instantaneous communications technology that links up billions of people and expands access to untold quantities of information over the entire globe? Does this revolution in technology genuinely enhance human connection or just the opposite? Does it make us smarter in some ways, dumber in others?
Gary Small, a UCLA psychiatrist, neuroscientist, expert on memory and aging, and author, with his wife Gigi Vorgan, of iBrain: Surviving the Technological Alteration of the Modern Mind, is on the cutting edge of research about how our digital world is transforming the human brain. In this interview, he discusses how technology is changing our minds and suggests when therapists should respond to clients whose relationship with technology has become unbalanced.
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RH: How did you get started looking at how technology influences the brain?
SMALL: My field is geriatric psychiatry, and I’ve done a lot of research over many years on brain function, brain structure, brain aging, and mood and memory. As a tech geek myself, I was drawn to the question of how all these new technologies are affecting the brain. At some point, the question that most interested me changed from “How can we use technology to measure the brain as it ages” to “Let’s find out what this other technology is doing to the brain at every age.”
RH: Speaking of all ages, you were recently quoted in a New York Times article about the impact of easy-to-use tablet computers on toddlers. What’s your take: good or bad?
SMALL: Basically, we don’t know, but there’s a growing concern because a lot of parents are increasingly using tablets and other digital technology as pacifiers. Is that going to inhibit children’s development of language skills? Some studies suggest that too much screen time could contribute to AD/HD symptoms and lower performance in school, but there’s also a lot of individual variation: some children are more sensitive than others to large amounts of screen time.
RH: Speaking of the impact of technology, how about adults? Is it true that my cell phone is destroying my capacity to remember phone numbers?
SMALL: It’s not destroying it, but basically what you’re describing is a nonissue. The reality is that you don’t need your brain to remember phone numbers in today’s world. For that and many other things, you can use your digital devices to augment your biological memory—for remembering names and faces, and for focusing your attention when you’re having a conversation. In fact, your brain power is better spent learning the apps to use so you can take advantage of the computer as an extension of your biological brain.
RH: So don’t go overboard in seeing computers as having a damaging effect on our cognitive capacities?
SMALL: Exactly. [Phone rings in background.] Please excuse me for a moment [On hold. Four minutes of Muzak.] Hi. I’m sorry about that. I’m afraid I’ve got a fundraiser right now that needs a little bit of my attention. I don’t usually take calls like this, but this underlines part of the whole problem with technology.
What I was just doing in taking that call is called continuous partial attention—scanning the environment for something that’s more imminent than what’s going on. It’s actually a stressful thing that’s not good for our brains or for our relationships. In fact, right now I feel a little guilty that I wasn’t paying full attention to you.
RH: No harm done! Actually, I’m so used to being interrupted by technology that I hardly even notice it.
SMALL: This is one of the issues that people frequently experience in face-to-face conversations these days. They’re talking with someone who won’t look at them because the other person is texting at the same time. So they think, “Eh? Does this person really care about me?” This is having more and more of an impact on the level of social connection people feel.
RH: How’s the influence of technology different from any other factors on social connection?
SMALL: We don’t exactly know, but the principle is this: your brain is sensitive to mental stimuli from moment to moment. If you spend a lot of time with a repeated mental stimulus, neural circuits that control that stimulation will strengthen at the cost of weakening other neural circuits. Basically, most of us are logging too much technology time, and we’re paying a price. We’re not engaging this powerful brain in activities like looking people in the eye, noticing nonverbal cues and emotional expressions, empathizing with other people. That’s a big concern in today’s technological world.
RH: So it’s not technology itself that’s the issue: it’s the fact that technology takes us away from so many other important social activities?
SMALL: Right. And there’s the very real issue of technology and addiction. Some people are addicted
to video games or to shopping online or gambling online, and that
can be destructive to their lives. Studies suggest it can worsen AD/HD, and it may even contribute to the development of autism spectrum disorders.
RH: When should therapists be concerned about a client’s relationship with technology?
SMALL: My alarm goes off if clients keep interrupting a therapy session because they’re answering texts or making calls or checking websites. Any time I see a patient with an inability to unplug for a while—someone who can’t have a conversation because he’s too busy messing with technology—I consider it an issue worth discussing.
RH: What impact might technology have on the future of therapy?
SMALL: Of course, many therapists already use technology in their
practice. Video conferencing and the use of virtual-reality therapy for people with post-traumatic stress and phobias or obsessive-compulsive disorders are increasingly common. There are applications you can download to help with mood and anxiety disorders. Clients can even wear sensors that will alert their therapist when they’ve reached a certain threshold point of anxiety. I think we can take advantage of technology to enhance therapy and increase its effectiveness.
RH: So you’re optimistic about our future with technology?
SMALL: I have faith in humans, and I think we’re going to make the right decisions. We need to bear in mind that technology is neither all good nor all bad. The challenge is to integrate it into our lives, rather than let it become something that enslaves and controls us.
But with young kids, I do have a special caution. The parents of small children have a responsibility to make sure they don’t overuse it and that they spend plenty of time offline. For adults, same thing: don’t spend hours and hours just answering your email. As with so many other issues in life, it’s a question of balance and putting things in perspective.
Ryan Howes, Ph.D., is a psychologist, writer, musician, and clinical professor at Fuller Graduate School of Psychology in Pasadena, California. He blogs “In Therapy” for Psychology Today. Contact: rhowes@mindspring.com; website: www.ryanhowes.net.
Finding the Hero Within with Ken HardyBy Ryan Howes
One of the hallmarks of the family therapy movement of the ’60s, ’70s, and ’80s was the exploration of the power of social issues like race, class, and ethnic background in clients’ lives. Leading figures in this movement, like Salvador Minuchin, Braulio Montalvo, Marianne Walters, and Monica McGoldrick, were outspoken about the importance of paying attention to the impact of social issues in the therapy room. But these days, we don’t hear much about the connection between psychotherapy and the larger social issues of the day. It seems that, for most therapists today, multiculturalism is a required, four-hour CE workshop, not a cause worthy of attention. One exception is Kenneth Hardy, a professor of family therapy at Drexel University in Philadelphia, who’s dedicated himself to working with troubled inner-city adolescents and keeping alive psychotherapy’s social conscience.
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RH: You once said: “My training prepared me to be a pretty good white therapist.” Could you elaborate on that?
HARDY: I did my graduate training in the early 1980s at the Medical Research Institute in Palo Alto, and spent time at the Family Therapy Institute in Washington, D.C., with Jay Haley. I learned a great deal at both places, but there was little that spoke to me as a person of color. Whatever discussion there was about race or culture tended to pathologize people of color without seeing their inherent strengths. When I left my graduate program and got a job at a psychiatric outpatient clinic in Brooklyn working with a population that was largely people of color, I saw the first day that there was a massive disconnect between what my training had taught me and what they needed from me. While I’d been well trained, I felt like I was a white therapist in black skin.
RH: Has training changed since that time?
HARDY: Well, I think there’s been improvement. You’ll certainly find more faculty of color in training programs—not a substantial number, but one or two people. You’ll find some course content focused on themes of race, class, and ethnicity. But when I talk with students of color, the kinds of experiences they describe today are chillingly similar to the ones I experienced some 30 years ago. They still don’t feel entirely safe bringing up issues of race or ethnicity. Is it better than when I was a student? Absolutely, it’s better.
RH: You described the shift in your work with inner-city teens as moving from, “What’s wrong with you?” to “What happened to you?” Could you elaborate on this?
HARDY: Lots of the young people I see have been perpetrators and done some pretty horrific things in the world. But as a therapist, I’ve found it most useful to start by getting curious about what happened in their lives that contributed to their violent behavior or other aspects of who they are. I see them not just as perpetrators, but perpetrators who were themselves victims before they became perpetrators. So I typically ask early on, “Who were you before you became who you are today?” I want them to think about the events in their lives that reshaped them and led them to be where they are today.
The lives of these kids are filled with trauma, and trauma can reshape every aspect of our lives. As a therapist, I begin by looking at what happened along the way to clients that’s incited this shift in them. I’ve found that doing that is a much more helpful place to begin than trying to decide what’s wrong with them.
RH: What does this approach look like?
HARDY: The kids I see are coming in for things like robbery, violent crime, or chronic truancy. I’ve found again and again that trauma provides a powerful backdrop to those presenting problems. It’s really important not to start the relationship by focusing on their criminal activity. So I’m asking them to talk about their experiences of being poor, black kids in a poor neighborhood of Philadelphia, for example.
RH: You mention that a big part of your work with these young folks is affirmation. What do you mean?
HARDY: I once overheard someone talking about how a periodontist had to impact his gum and create some sort of synthetic gum. Something like that happens in psychotherapy. Often we have to build up the underdeveloped parts of people and find strengths where we can—to lay a foundation for growth. Affirmation starts to rebuild or restore what’s been destroyed, to create a foundation from which therapy can actually take place.
That’s not always so easy, especially if someone’s life narrative as a result of trauma is that “I ain’t nothing.” That can be difficult to rewrite. If I dare to see something redeemable in such people, they may think I’m trying to manipulate them. How could I honestly see something valuable in them?
RH: You like to talk about seeking out our clients’ “untapped heroism.” What does that mean?
HARDY: It comes from my deep conviction that no matter how egregious our behavior, we still have in us some redeemable qualities—something that sets off a flicker of light in the midst of everything that’s awful. So I’m always looking for that quality of what I call heroism in these young people—that part within them that’s managed to survive against tremendous odds. Heroism is this undying will to keep on keeping on, despite all kinds of adversity.
Whether you find that quality in your clients depends on what you look for. A therapist who looks for pathology sees it. A therapist who looks for strength finds it. You have to change what you look for in order to change what you see.
Ryan Howes, Ph.D., is a psychologist, writer, musician, and clinical professor at Fuller Graduate School of Psychology in Pasadena, California. He blogs “In Therapy” for Psychology Today. Contact: rhowes@mindspring.com; website: www.ryanhowes.net. Tell us what you think about this article by e-mail at letters@psychnetworker.org.
Frederic Luskin on the Power of ForgivenessA new calendar inspires many to turn over a new leaf. For some of us, this may mean learning to turn the other cheek. In recent years, the biological benefits of forgiveness have been widely publicized: lower blood pressure and cholesterol, better sleep, and an improved immune system. Psychologically, people who forgive show lower levels of depression, anxiety, and anger, enjoy better relationships, and report higher levels of optimism and happiness. Sounds great, so why is forgiveness so damn difficult?
Frederic Luskin has some interesting thoughts on that subject. As director of the Stanford Forgiveness Project, he’s studied forgiveness for the past 20 years. He authored Forgive for Good: A Proven Prescription for Health and Happiness and has shared his wisdom with survivors in Northern Ireland, as well as those at Ground Zero in Manhattan.
Since he’s an expert on the psychology of forgiveness and on therapeutic pathways to achieving it, we thought the beginning of the year might be an especially good time to hear from him.
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RH: How did you become interested in forgiveness?
Luskin: In addition to the pain of being badly hurt by a close friend without having any idea how to deal with it, I needed to find a dissertation topic when I was graduating from Stanford. This was before there was a lot of research about forgiveness. I thought what I learned about getting over my own wounding might have a broader application, and it just seemed like a good opportunity to bring more psychological understanding to something that’s traditionally been such a spiritual concept.
RH: I’m reminded of the Alexander Pope quote: “To err is human; to forgive, divine.” Do we equate forgiveness with spirituality or God more than we do other virtues?
Luskin: I think so, because it’s so difficult. The human tendency is to deliver payback for any hurt that’s been experienced.
RH: The “divine” part of that statement suggests that it requires supernatural strength to forgive.
Luskin: I don’t believe that. I think it takes something more than the essential selfishness that most of us operate out of, but I don’t think it’s divine to understand that you don’t want somebody else to suffer just because you’ve suffered.
RH: As you’ve seen, it’s terribly difficult for a lot of people.
Luskin: That’s part of the reason why the research that we did is so important. Making a connection between enhancing one’s health and forgiveness gives people additional motivation to do something that they might not do otherwise. People may not worry about whether they’re going to heaven, but at least forgiveness reduces their blood pressure and their chance of having a heart attack.
RH: Your work calls into question several beliefs about forgiveness. I’ll toss out a few true-or-false statements here: “Forgiveness means forgetting.”
Luskin: That’s false. It’s actually remembering differently. While lack of forgiveness is remembering something with an edge or a grudge or a sense of injustice, forgiveness means remembering it more benignly, with compassion. It involves some purpose of moving ahead, rather than just being stuck in the past.
RH: “Forgiveness requires repentance from the other.”
Luskin: The fact is that you can forgive someone who’s dead. So it can’t require that.
RH: Isn’t it easier to forgive when the other person is repentant?
Luskin: Certainly, if somebody is really apologetic and takes responsibility—“My bad. I really hurt you. No excuses.” Then forgiveness is easier. It’s not just bad because you got hurt, but I did something wrong.
When someone says, “I’m sorry because you’re hurt,” well, that can make the person who’s been injured feel at fault because they were hurt.
That’s an offensive kind of apology. It’s different when you say: “Boy, I did wrong, independently of whether or not you got hurt. I also see how that wrong has impacted you, and I’m sorry for that.”
So there are two steps—“I did wrong, and that wrong hurt you.” Then the next step is, “Since it’s my responsibility, what can I do to make it better for you?” That’s a true apology, and that makes a real difference.
RH: Is that because it validates the feelings of the victim?
Luskin: Always.
RH: It says, yes, it really was your fault, I don’t have to blame myself or take some of that responsibility. You’re taking it.
Luskin: Well, you still have responsibility for living your life and moving on, but at least that person has said that they’re a significant contributor to the distress and the tears.
RH: Another belief: “Forgiveness is a one-time thing.”
Luskin: No. It’s a process we do over and over. Sometimes you’re reminded of painful situations when you least expect it. Sometimes the person comes back into your life, or you’re just remembering what they did and you have to go through it again.
RH: One final statement: “Forgiveness means everything returns to the way things were.”
Luskin: Sometimes it returns to the way it was, but sometimes you can’t go back. After all, how can you go back if someone close to you has been murdered? Nevertheless, if somebody makes a mistake and they say they’re sorry and ask forgiveness, you can go back to the same type of relationship that you had.
RH: I heard a talk at which you said: “Forgiveness is the experiencing of being at peace right now, no matter what happened five minutes or five years ago.” How is peace related to forgiveness?
Luskin: What is forgiveness except the experience of peace around your own life? It’s acknowledging that you’re OK. Forgiveness is all about people’s perception of their life. If I feel bad, that’s my experience. Just because bad things happen doesn’t mean that I have to behave badly. Understanding that can make a huge difference for many people.
RH: Why do you think we have such a tendency to perpetuate the bad?
Luskin: Part of that is the way our neurology is wired to look for things that are wrong in order to keep us safe. Part of it is the way many cultures foster revenge, retribution, payback, and total self-absorption.
RH: I’ve noticed that victimhood can make people feel like they’re in a position of power, one that they’re reluctant to give up.
Luskin: But feeling resentful and victimized is a highly limited form of power. The price you pay is feeling perpetually uncomfortable and off center. We get angry when life isn’t working; we don’t get angry when life is working.
If you see people who are angry or who are nursing a long-standing grudge, it’s probably because their life isn’t working, and they don’t know what else to do. The whole task of forgiveness comes down to redirecting energy from a preoccupation with helpless resentment to finding a better way to live one’s life.
Ryan Howes, Ph.D., is a psychologist, writer, musician, and clinical professor at Fuller Graduate School of Psychology in Pasadena, California. He blogs “In Therapy” for Psychology Today. Contact: rhowes@mindspring.com; website: www.ryanhowes.net.
Tell us what you think about this article by e-mail at letters@psychnetworker.org, or at www.psychotherapynetworker.org. Log in and you’ll find the comment section on every page of the online magazine.
By the time you’re reading this, the 2012 election will have been decided, and we’ll all have had our fill of the partisan rancor that’s become commonplace in politics. Perhaps you yourself have had the experience of getting lost in an argument in which you became exasperated that people on the other side couldn’t see what was so obvious, despite your best efforts to reason with them.
When caught in the stalemate of a political debate, the advice of Jonathan Haidt, author of The Righteous Mind: Why Good People Are Divided by Politics and Religion and a social psychologist in the New York University Stern School of Business, is to save our breath–or at least recognize that what we think we’re arguing about isn’t really what we’re arguing about. Haidt believes that most political debates, at least the way they’re usually conducted, are useless because the underlying issues aren’t what they appear to be on the surface. Politics, he says, is ultimately about our stance on fundamental moral beliefs and group loyalties–things that aren’t usually influenced by facts, figures, or rational policy debate. In the interview that follows, he offers a perspective on why we vote the way that we do that differs from what you’re likely to read about in our mainstream election-season coverage.
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RH: Your book is based on the idea that most of us don’t understand the true roots of political differences. What are we missing?
Haidt: People often assume that politics is primarily about self-interest. They wonder why someone would vote for a candidate who’s going to raise their taxes or cut their benefits. But politics, especially at the presidential level, is more like religion than a shopping excursion. Despite all the individualism and materialism within our culture, our group affiliations matter deeply to most of us. Politics begins to make more sense when you understand it as a tribal phenomenon.
RH: So, in politics, group membership trumps individual need?
Haidt: Yes. The more we care about our ethnic group, our city, our state, our occupational group, the likelier we are to vote for politicians who we believe will advance those interests, even when they diverge from our individual interests. For example, it’s striking how many liberal parents with children weren’t more opposed to forced school bussing in the 1970s. Politics is largely about moral missions for the nation, and the president is expected to be the high priest of the American civic religion. It can be illuminating to see the left and right in this country as practicing different civic religions, and looking to very different high priests.
RH: From a moral standpoint, what’s the difference in the outlook of the left and the right?
Haidt: To begin with, left and right have different understandings of fairness. The left tends to focus on equality, with an emphasis on equality of outcome. In contrast, the right cares exclusively about proportionality of outcome: if outcomes are equalized when deservingness isn’t the same, they consider that an abomination. This is why welfare is such a contentious issue. When social conservatives look at people who might have contributed to their own sorry state, they’re deeply offended by the thought of bailing them out, but on the left, compassion for those who are suffering is more widespread. There’s a basic difference in moral attitude about how each side thinks about “fairness.”
RH: But fairness is often raised by both sides in debating social-justice issues, like gay marriage.
Haidt: The left tends to focus on victim groups–on people whom they see as being treated badly and denied opportunity. We’ve had several civil-rights revolutions in this country since the ’60s, first for African Americans, then for women, and then the disabled. Gay people are pretty much the last group against whom it’s legal to discriminate. That’s become one of the central issues for the left in recent years.
RH: It’s no secret that most therapists are politically progressive and aware of the limitations of the right’s perspective.
What are the limitations of the left’s perspective?
Haidt: The basic principle of moral psychology is to begin by understanding someone’s concept of sacredness. Once you do, you’ll find an intense energy, as well as some blindness. If you know what a group holds sacred, you’ll see what most animates it, but you’ll also see places where it loses its perspective and can make mistakes in the name of politics.
An example would be the Obama administration’s position on forcing organizations to pay for contraception. Had there been organizations that were actively banning contraception, they would have been an understandable foe. Instead, the question became, “Should Catholic hospitals and schools, despite their moral position, be forced to pay for contraception?” When the Obama team went ahead and pushed that issue, it was totally unprepared for the outrage it triggered.
RH: Does it come down to the left and right just having fundamentally different ideas of how things should be?
Haidt: Well, both sides care about fairness, and both sides care about liberty–but on the right, their version of fairness is much more focused on catching cheaters and slackers. The idea of a person getting something for nothing really makes their blood boil. That’s why we had Republican Congressman Joe Wilson’s “You lie!” moment during Obama’s healthcare speech in 2009. It was over the question of whether illegal immigrants can get free healthcare–something that deeply offends the right’s sense of what’s morally correct. On the left, people approach that issue from the perspective of compassion: some vulnerable, hardworking illegal immigrant is here in America and gets hit by a car, what should happen to him? Are we going to let him die? It’s a fundamental difference of viewpoint, but rational debate leads nowhere because you can’t change people’s minds on moral and political issues with arguments and evidence.
RH: Why not?
Haidt: Political views aren’t like views about factual matters. If you believe that it’s faster to drive to the airport than take mass transit, and I give you evidence that mass transit is faster, there’s a good chance that I’ll change your mind, because your goal is actually to get to the airport more quickly. With political and moral questions, our goal isn’t “the truth.” That’s why it’s always vital to bear in mind the importance of group membership when trying to understand political differences. Political beliefs act as badges of membership, badges that say who we are and give us a sense of meaning and purpose. They’re badges that we display to show our moral character. So simply refuting someone’s views about global warming or needle-exchange programs or abortion or anything else will have little effect, because people aren’t going to betray their team because you show them evidence that they’re wrong.
RH: So why do we invest so much energy in debating politics?
Haidt: The goal is to be a good team member. We argue not so much to persuade as to show off our team membership. Blog debates on the Internet are really instructive about this phenomenon because it’s so clear there’s no chance of persuasion. People just get more and more extreme in stating their case and showing off how cleverly they can state their arguments. They’re really not interested in what the other side is saying.
RH: If we’re so fundamentally different, how do we peacefully coexist without getting more and more polarized?
Haidt: We first need to realize we actually do peacefully coexist. Things are very heated and getting worse by the decade, and yet political violence is extremely low in the United States, so we should thank heavens for that. As a social psychologist, I generally believe that the situation is extremely powerful, and that the context tends to swamp individual personality traits. So the most important single variable in your politics is the part of the country where you grew up. If you were born in rural Utah versus Boston, that’s probably more important than your score on the personality trait of openness to experience. Nevertheless, the big surprise revealed in research over the last 15 years has been that environment isn’t everything. There’s a growing consensus that temperament matters, and that political leaning isn’t somehow different from all the other personality traits.
RH: What’s the contribution of temperament?
Haidt: Our tendency to be on the left or the right is as heritable as anything else–around 0.5, depending on the measure. For example, our genes predispose us to seek change, diversity, and variety, or order, stability, and predictability. People with different brains will find different kinds of arguments and different social settings attractive. To understand political attitudes fully, you have to understand a range of factors, including genetics, neuroscience, childhood development, adolescent development, and cultural psychology.
RH: What do therapists need to know to understand the kinds of conflicts that revolve around political divisions?
Haidt: I’m not sure it’s especially helpful for therapists to empathize with people’s political beliefs per se, but I think they should be sensitive to the moral differences that are underlying cases in which ideology is dividing someone from a loved one on the other side of the political spectrum. I think we need to be respectful of both sides and recognize that both are really wise about the different kinds of threats that exist in the world. What the study of moral psychology can do is help everyone understand the other side and treat them with more understanding, even honor. The alternative is the kind of demonization that happens when our partisan reactivity activates the endless cycle of argument and rebuttal that we see too often these days.
Ryan Howes, Ph.D., is a psychologist, writer, musician, and clinical professor at Fuller Graduate School of Psychology in Pasadena, California. He blogs “In Therapy” for Psychology Today.
Contact: rhowes@mindspring.com; website: www.ryanhowes.net. Tell us what you think about this article by e-mail at letters@psychnetworker.org, or at www.psychotherapynetworker.org. Log in and you’ll find the comment section on every page of the online Magazine.

By Ryan Howes
Back in the 1970s, Donald Meichenbaum was part of a group of innovators that included Albert Ellis and Aaron Beck. Together they challenged the prevailing behaviorist paradigm, lobbying to have the psychology field recognize the pervasive influence of thoughts and beliefs on observable behavior. Four decades later, the sometimes acerbic Meichenbaum remains an outspoken critic of what he considers unproven therapeutic practices and fads, upholding standards of empirical proof for clinical methods within the field. Now 70 and retired from his professorship at the University of Waterloo in Canada, he’s presently research director of the Melissa Institute for Violence Prevention in Miami, and has a particular interest in ensuring that the combat vets returning from the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq receive the best treatment available. As active as ever and a popular figure on the workshop circuit, he recently talked about conclusions he’s drawn from decades of experience in the field.
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RH: My students have an ongoing debate about the nature of therapy, and how much the therapist-client interaction should resemble a real relationship.
MEICHENBAUM: I get hung up with the word “real.” I mean, what’s an “unreal” relationship? Clearly, when we’re talking about therapeutic alliance, we’re talking about a relationship. The therapeutic alliance depends on the degree to which the therapist and the client agree on a set of goals and the means to get to those goals. That alliance necessarily has to do with the affective bond that develops, and the alignment between the client’s view of what’s wrong and how to get help and what the therapist has to offer. If those are in line, then you’re going to get a therapeutic bond, and everything follows from that.
RH: So the relationship needs to be real enough in clients’ lives that they’ll take the process seriously?
MEICHENBAUM: Yeah, and I’m essentially at my therapeutic best when the clients are themselves offering the advice I’d otherwise offer. In other words, I need clients to convince me that what they need is cognitive-behavioral therapy (CBT). So I use a lot of Socratic questioning to draw out people’s own wisdom. I’m a bit like Peter Falk playing Columbo: I try to get people to provide the answers they’re looking for themselves, rather than trying to become their surrogate frontal lobe.
RH: A former client just contacted me after coming home from Afghanistan. He’s had a tough time, and he’d been specifically advised to seek out EMDR treatment for post-traumatic stress disorder. What would you recommend?
MEICHENBAUM: I’ve done battle with the EMDR people so many times that I don’t want to get back into that debate. Rather than thinking that there’s one approach to PTSD that’s across-the-board better than any other, I think it’s more important to look at what’s common among all these procedures, and help people understand that there are a range of methods—besides exposure-based interventions—that can be helpful.
The choice of which method to recommend should be determined by the client’s symptomology. If your client’s main problem is hypervigilance, avoidance behavior, and mistaken beliefs, then some variation of in vivo exposure, where he can tell the narrative and then change the mistaken beliefs, would be acceptable. But if, in fact, his primary concern is guilt—his feelings about killing a buddy in friendly fire or killing others—then the treatment of choice would be a procedure focused on guilt or moral injuries. The field has advanced to a point where we can now tailor interventions to fit more closely the specific nature of the client’s distress, not just the broad category of PTSD.
Researchers Anke Ehlers and David Clark have identified that the major problem that leads to chronic PTSD has to do with biographical memories. Many people need help to incorporate the trauma memory into the larger narrative of their lives. They need help getting a larger perspective.
The other thing that’s now emerging in the literature is that helping people with PTSD isn’t just about getting rid of bad thoughts, but retrieving positive thoughts of what they did to survive. There’s an increasing recognition of the need to incorporate into treatment resilience-engendering, strength-based interventions, such as fostering positive emotions, psychological flexibility, optimism, gratitude, and spirituality. I’ve been involved in developing iPod technology for returning service members (see www.warfighterdiaries.org). These videos can be downloaded onto an iPod and people can listen to these coping stories whenever they want. This project dovetails with the Constructive Narrative approach that I now advocate.
RH: So there’s no one true cure?
MEICHENBAUM: There’s no single model that fits all. I really see myself as an honest broker, so anyone who says I have the cure, like Steven Hayes’s idea that his Acceptance and Commitment Therapy is “The Third Wave”—ACT may work with many people, but it’s not a panacea.
RH: You’ve done research specifically on what constitutes therapeutic expertise or mastery. You’ve written that people need about seven years to become an expert at anything. Is that similar to the 10,000 hours to achieve expert status that Malcolm Gladwell writes about in The Outliers?
MEICHENBAUM: That’s exactly right, we’re using the same data—10,000 hours, or, if you’re a chess player, 50,000. I say it takes seven years for a therapist to become an expert, because that’s how long it takes to see enough patients really shape up. You learn by deliberative practice, learning from your mistakes.
RH: So what can less experienced therapists do to provide good client care while they’re gaining sufficient experience to move to the next level?
MEICHENBAUM: I think it’s a journey. Some people start off a bit ahead of others because they already have core skills, like knowing how to listen, how to reflect, those kinds of things. I think that the main thing is not to be sucked up by the hype that’s associated with certain therapy models—you need to be a critical consumer. It’s also important to find a good mentor and be part of a peer group in which you look closely at each other’s work.
I think that a crucial pathway to expertise in psychotherapy is to have the guts to audiotape or videotape your sessions, and watch them with someone else; we all need that kind of feedback. The other thing is that you should develop a habit of soliciting feedback from your patients. At the end of every session, you should ask them, “Is there anything I said or did, or anything I failed to say or do, that you found particularly helpful or unhelpful?” We all need to regularly do those kinds of dipstick assessments and solicit that kind of feedback. If you’re an athlete and you miss the shot, you get immediate feedback. If you hit the golf ball in the rough, you get immediate feedback. Psychotherapists don’t get that kind of feedback automatically; they have to ask for it.
RH: As one of the founders of CBT, how far do you think it’s come?
MEICHENBAUM: Years ago, the behavioral traditionalists attempted to get all cognitive types kicked out of the American Association of Behavioral Therapy. They tried to make sure that no articles with the word “cognition” appeared in journals like JABA [Journal of Applied Behavior Analysis]. A letter was even circulated specifically identifying people who were bastardizing behavior therapy. Today AABT has changed its name to the American Association of Cognitive Behavior Therapists. One has got to be impressed with that kind of growth.
In addition, there’s an increasing appreciation of the particular factors that make cognitive-behavior therapy effective, like the therapeutic alliance and the whole business of nurturing hope and attending to feelings. So I think CBT has continued to develop and embrace a broader perspective, recognizing that feelings impact thoughts, as well as thoughts impacting feelings.
Finally, I think that there’s a great deal more humility about the limitations of CBT. Recent studies in the area of depression highlight that behavioral activation and helping people get exercise is equally, or more, effective than cognitive therapy. In the area of substance abuse, CBT is no better than other kinds of interventions, like 12-step groups. In fact, in substance-abuse studies using CBT, there’s no evidence that the cognitions have changed, or that the mechanisms of change are in any way linked to the specific CBT procedures. So I think anyone who’s sensitive to the data has to be given pause by how little we still know about what particular mechanisms lead to change.
RH: It’s humbling!
MEICHENBAUM: Sure. I think if you’re honest in this profession, that’s usually the right stance.
Ryan Howes, Ph.D., is a psychologist, writer, musician, and clinical professor at Fuller Graduate School of Psychology in Pasadena, California. He blogs “In Therapy” for Psychology Today. Contact: rhowes@mind spring.com; www.ryanhowes.net.
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